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> Windows XP vs. Vista
Yuka
post Jul 5 2007, 01:39 PM
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QUOTE(Takeru-kun @ Jul 5 2007, 02:50 AM) *

Buy Vista if...
...
...you're a hardcore gamer.


Haha, you got to be kidding, right?

This post has been edited by Sauce XIV: Jul 5 2007, 01:39 PM


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zesler
post Jul 5 2007, 02:52 PM
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QUOTE(Takeru-kun @ Jul 4 2007, 11:50 PM) *

Buy Vista if...
  • ...XP crashes a lot, or is riddled with bugs, virii, and spyware.
  • ...your current computer is nice and fast (meaning 2+ GB RAM, 40+ GB HDD, and 2.0+ GHz processor).
  • ...you're a hardcore gamer.
  • ...you think Luna looks disgusting (I do).

Although I shouldn't argue, I will anyway in this case. Wouldn't you just use parallel or any similar program and use both(for anyone like hardcore gamers who want to use it all?)? You get both benefits and should one crash you can always use the other. *points to Mac/PC friend with Parallel*.

Doesn't any Window crash a lot? The only one I use that doesn't crash often, rarely actually, is Windows 98.
My computer is fast enough to support it.

The other comment is that since Windows Vista uses almost 3 times as much memory and CPU to run compared to XP wouldn't hardcore gamers stay with XP because they want as much FPS as they can get?

Also, although this is old news, its better to just buy a new computer, rather than upgrading it. There are weird glitches should you upgrade... forgot the list.

Luna?

By this point I'll just use the all windows program and run it all.... -_-

This post has been edited by zesler: Jul 5 2007, 02:55 PM


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Takeru-kun
post Jul 6 2007, 12:39 AM
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Although I shouldn't argue, you make some good points, so I will anyway.

QUOTE(zesler @ Jul 5 2007, 02:52 PM) *
Wouldn't you just use parallel or any similar program and use both(for anyone like hardcore gamers who want to use it all?)? You get both benefits and should one crash you can always use the other. *points to Mac/PC friend with Parallel*.


For starters, paralleling OS's isn't always an option. Focusing on Mac in particular, Mac OS X can't be run on a PC, or vice versa, without serious tweaking and lots of third-parties, which in the end make it a relentlessly glitchy experience. Then there are some people don't have nearly enough space to run two OS's at the same time, or would at least like as much available room as possible on their hard drive. Also, it's an inconvenience if one would have to switch between two OS's just to operate, an experience made worse by Vista's horrendously long boot time (2-5 minutes on a clean install). For those who can deal with it, I guess it isn't that big of a deal, but for most, it's an inconvenience. I mean... heck. I do it.

QUOTE(zesler @ Jul 5 2007, 02:52 PM) *
Doesn't any Window crash a lot? The only one I use that doesn't crash often, rarely actually, is Windows 98.
My computer is fast enough to support it.

Well, it's true that any Windows, and any operating system in general, will crash a lot. It's just that Vista does a helluva lot less crashing than older versions. I'm running Ultimate, and I barely if ever crash.

QUOTE(zesler @ Jul 5 2007, 02:52 PM) *
The other comment is that since Windows Vista uses almost 3 times as much memory and CPU to run compared to XP wouldn't hardcore gamers stay with XP because they want as much FPS as they can get?

Potentially, yes. That depends on how much memory the game uses, and how much memory you have. For someone who has a lot of memory, it wouldn't matter at all, because there wouldn't be any difference (I have 2GB RAM and have had no problems). The killer is that the new Direct3D 10 API is exclusive to Vista, making it a must-have for anyone who wants to squeeze the most graphic potential out of their games.

QUOTE(zesler @ Jul 5 2007, 02:52 PM) *
Also, although this is old news, its better to just buy a new computer, rather than upgrading it. There are weird glitches should you upgrade... forgot the list.

This is very true, and I forgot to add that to my "Do Not Buy" list. It's risky business if you try doing an upgrade from XP, which is why I highly recommend a reformat and a clean install. Most people wouldn't like reformatting their computer though.

QUOTE(zesler @ Jul 5 2007, 02:52 PM) *
Luna?

Bleh. (<-- That's a link. Click it. I always wondered why this forum system never colored links.)

This post has been edited by Takeru-kun: Jul 6 2007, 12:40 AM
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zesler
post Jul 6 2007, 02:34 AM
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I'll continue shall we?

QUOTE(Takeru-kun @ Jul 5 2007, 05:39 PM) *

For starters, paralleling OS's isn't always an option. Focusing on Mac in particular, Mac OS X can't be run on a PC, or vice versa, without serious tweaking and lots of third-parties, which in the end make it a relentlessly glitchy experience. Then there are some people don't have nearly enough space to run two OS's at the same time, or would at least like as much available room as possible on their hard drive. Also, it's an inconvenience if one would have to switch between two OS's just to operate, an experience made worse by Vista's horrendously long boot time (2-5 minutes on a clean install). For those who can deal with it, I guess it isn't that big of a deal, but for most, it's an inconvenience. I mean... heck. I do it.

Hard Drives are not expensive... a little of $100 for 500GB hard drive is not expensive. Also, it doesn't take that much to switch. My friend runs it in an explorer window with a separate process. I see Macs doing it often. Although it does cost money to get the said OS $50~150 and software if needed $50~150 again, its often better because should it fail in one OS switch it. Furthermore, my giant computer I'm visiting sells the "Complete Windows Pack" where it allows you to run any and all windows , 3.1 NT, etc. Space 2GB. No format required and runs off additional windows created.

QUOTE(Takeru-kun @ Jul 5 2007, 05:39 PM) *

Well, it's true that any Windows, and any operating system in general, will crash a lot. It's just that Vista does a helluva lot less crashing than older versions. I'm running Ultimate, and I barely if ever crash.

Everything crashes. Thats how it goes. Its not perfect. It also depends on how you use the computer. The same also applies with me. It just about never crashes and even if I shut it off in the middle of something. I can boot it and it still works with no problems. Can't say no to that when you don't have a UPS.

Only question, did your computer come with Ultimate or did you have to buy it and upgrade it.

This post has been edited by zesler: Jul 6 2007, 02:35 AM


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jcdietz03
post Jul 15 2007, 03:07 PM
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QUOTE(zesler @ Jul 3 2007, 01:39 PM) *

Xp. Vista moved the location of some of the stuff(run for example isn't in the start menu), you need more ram to be able to use all the said functions and possibly a graphics card for the "aero" interface. Furthermore, you can change your XP to look like Vista with "aero" interface and various other functions.

Every power user uses Windows-R to access the run box. Presumably that still works???

Graphics and memory get cheaper every day.

I am surprised you didn't mention compatibility problems (Especially with games). Has anyone noticed anything w/ emulators?

DX10 guys: You need to say "DX10 looks better than DX9." Also there is one DX10 compatible game now: MS Flight Simulator. I will be a bigger deal in the future, but isn't now.

Does Vista really never crash? XP crashes extremely rarely for me - I can't remember the last time it did.

Microsoft wants too much money for something I don't need. I like the clean interface of XP. Aero - It has cool factor but I was never a cool guy.

Also, I tried Linux but found it to be impossible to set up and configure. There is too much not working stuff and not enough industry support of it (At least for home users) to be viable. All I wanted was my Zonet wireless card to talk to my router running WPA-PSK. I couldn't do it.
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Takeru-kun
post Jul 17 2007, 10:32 PM
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QUOTE(zesler @ Jul 6 2007, 02:34 AM) *

Hard Drives are not expensive... a little of $100 for 500GB hard drive is not expensive. Also, it doesn't take that much to switch. My friend runs it in an explorer window with a separate process. I see Macs doing it often. Although it does cost money to get the said OS $50~150 and software if needed $50~150 again, its often better because should it fail in one OS switch it. Furthermore, my giant computer I'm visiting sells the "Complete Windows Pack" where it allows you to run any and all windows , 3.1 NT, etc. Space 2GB. No format required and runs off additional windows created.

Well that's the difference. We're not talking about the "Complete Windows Pack", we're talking about Windows Vista. The boot time is long as a bitch. And laptops don't have expandable HD space, unless you're talking external hard drives, and externals are generally more expensive than internals.

QUOTE(zesler @ Jul 6 2007, 02:34 AM) *

Everything crashes. Thats how it goes. Its not perfect. It also depends on how you use the computer. The same also applies with me. It just about never crashes and even if I shut it off in the middle of something. I can boot it and it still works with no problems. Can't say no to that when you don't have a UPS.

Right. That's what I said. Everything crashes. But again, Vista just does a helluva lot less of it than XP (I've had terrible experiences with XP on my last three or four computers).

QUOTE(zesler @ Jul 6 2007, 02:34 AM) *

Only question, did your computer come with Ultimate or did you have to buy it and upgrade it.

It came with it, but even if I had bought it at the store, I would have reformatted my computer before installing it. Because, you know, that's clearly an option.

QUOTE(jcdietz03 @ Jul 15 2007, 03:07 PM) *

Every power user uses Windows-R to access the run box. Presumably that still works???

I have no idea what Windows R is.

QUOTE(jcdietz03 @ Jul 15 2007, 03:07 PM) *

Graphics and memory get cheaper every day.

It's still expensive at this point for Vista Premium Capable results.

QUOTE(jcdietz03 @ Jul 15 2007, 03:07 PM) *

I am surprised you didn't mention compatibility problems (Especially with games). Has anyone noticed anything w/ emulators?

No.

QUOTE(jcdietz03 @ Jul 15 2007, 03:07 PM) *

DX10 guys: You need to say "DX10 looks better than DX9." Also there is one DX10 compatible game now: MS Flight Simulator. I will be a bigger deal in the future, but isn't now.

True.

QUOTE(jcdietz03 @ Jul 15 2007, 03:07 PM) *

Does Vista really never crash? XP crashes extremely rarely for me - I can't remember the last time it did.

Vista never crashed for me. Not unless I induced the crash on my own by doing my usual experiments.

QUOTE(jcdietz03 @ Jul 15 2007, 03:07 PM) *

Microsoft wants too much money for something I don't need. I like the clean interface of XP. Aero - It has cool factor but I was never a cool guy.

Personally... I think XP's theme looks disgusting. Clashy colors and all. Vista accomplishes what Mac OS X accomplished: a clean look that's still very appealing, yet retains functionality and intuitivity. Of course, that depends on whether it's your cup of tea or not.

QUOTE(jcdietz03 @ Jul 15 2007, 03:07 PM) *

Also, I tried Linux but found it to be impossible to set up and configure. There is too much not working stuff and not enough industry support of it (At least for home users) to be viable. All I wanted was my Zonet wireless card to talk to my router running WPA-PSK. I couldn't do it.

Try Ubuntu.


This post would have been so much easier to write if Invision wasn't such epic failure. Get SMF.

This post has been edited by Takeru-kun: Jul 17 2007, 10:34 PM
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zesler
post Jul 25 2007, 02:32 AM
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QUOTE(Takeru-kun @ Jul 17 2007, 03:32 PM) *

QUOTE(zesler @ Jul 6 2007, 02:34 AM) *

Hard Drives are not expensive... a little of $100 for 500GB hard drive is not expensive. Also, it doesn't take that much to switch. My friend runs it in an explorer window with a separate process. I see Macs doing it often. Although it does cost money to get the said OS $50~150 and software if needed $50~150 again, its often better because should it fail in one OS switch it. Furthermore, my giant computer I'm visiting sells the "Complete Windows Pack" where it allows you to run any and all windows , 3.1 NT, etc. Space 2GB. No format required and runs off additional windows created.

Well that's the difference. We're not talking about the "Complete Windows Pack", we're talking about Windows Vista. The boot time is long as a bitch. And laptops don't have expandable HD space, unless you're talking external hard drives, and externals are generally more expensive than internals.

I'm not talking about Laptops. The Packs[Window packs] doesn't execute when your computer starts, or at least my friend's doesn't. Once it fully starts you execute it as a normal program. As for the mac/linux thing, it doesn't take that long for him as well.

QUOTE(Takeru-kun @ Jul 17 2007, 03:32 PM) *

QUOTE(zesler @ Jul 6 2007, 02:34 AM) *

Everything crashes. Thats how it goes. Its not perfect. It also depends on how you use the computer. The same also applies with me. It just about never crashes and even if I shut it off in the middle of something. I can boot it and it still works with no problems. Can't say no to that when you don't have a UPS.

Right. That's what I said. Everything crashes. But again, Vista just does a helluva lot less of it than XP (I've had terrible experiences with XP on my last three or four computers).

Bummer, well I guess I see what you mean about that. Hating XP and all.

QUOTE(Takeru-kun @ Jul 17 2007, 03:32 PM) *

QUOTE(zesler @ Jul 6 2007, 02:34 AM) *

Only question, did your computer come with Ultimate or did you have to buy it and upgrade it.

It came with it, but even if I had bought it at the store, I would have reformatted my computer before installing it. Because, you know, that's clearly an option.

Well I would do that too... Clean installs work better because your theoretically reformmating the drive, like new, and burning it all in.

QUOTE(Takeru-kun @ Jul 17 2007, 03:32 PM) *

QUOTE(jcdietz03 @ Jul 15 2007, 03:07 PM) *

Every power user uses Windows-R to access the run box. Presumably that still works???

I have no idea what Windows R is.
He's talking about the Hot Key [Windows Icon Key] + [R]. Yes that still executes the run window thankfully.


QUOTE(Takeru-kun @ Jul 17 2007, 03:32 PM) *

QUOTE(jcdietz03 @ Jul 15 2007, 03:07 PM) *

Graphics and memory get cheaper every day.

It's still expensive at this point for Vista Premium Capable results.

And the fact is new cards keep on coming out. The old ones do go one sale and if they don't sell off, they disappear(well they get scrapped and use in newer cards or remelted). So yes you are getting more memory but the good cards still cost a good computer. X_X

QUOTE(Takeru-kun @ Jul 17 2007, 03:32 PM) *

QUOTE(jcdietz03 @ Jul 15 2007, 03:07 PM) *

I am surprised you didn't mention compatibility problems (Especially with games). Has anyone noticed anything w/ emulators?

No.
Takeru-kun probably doesn't use emulators. Anyway you can probably find patches for that... I'm not so sure myself. EDIT:Yeah Vista cannot run emulators, well from what the site says. (http://www.jesperjuul.net/ludologist/?p=205)


QUOTE(Takeru-kun @ Jul 17 2007, 03:32 PM) *

QUOTE(jcdietz03 @ Jul 15 2007, 03:07 PM) *

DX10 guys: You need to say "DX10 looks better than DX9." Also there is one DX10 compatible game now: MS Flight Simulator. I will be a bigger deal in the future, but isn't now.

True.



QUOTE(Takeru-kun @ Jul 17 2007, 03:32 PM) *

QUOTE(jcdietz03 @ Jul 15 2007, 03:07 PM) *

Does Vista really never crash? XP crashes extremely rarely for me - I can't remember the last time it did.

Vista never crashed for me. Not unless I induced the crash on my own by doing my usual experiments.
Well, we all have our good and bad computers....


QUOTE(Takeru-kun @ Jul 17 2007, 03:32 PM) *

QUOTE(jcdietz03 @ Jul 15 2007, 03:07 PM) *

Microsoft wants too much money for something I don't need. I like the clean interface of XP. Aero - It has cool factor but I was never a cool guy.

Personally... I think XP's theme looks disgusting. Clashy colors and all. Vista accomplishes what Mac OS X accomplished: a clean look that's still very appealing, yet retains functionality and intuitivity. Of course, that depends on whether it's your cup of tea or not.
You could theoretically get software to change it to what it looks like. I changed my XP to look like a mac. I added to areo interface to it. Pure preference really.


QUOTE(Takeru-kun @ Jul 17 2007, 03:32 PM) *

QUOTE(jcdietz03 @ Jul 15 2007, 03:07 PM) *

Also, I tried Linux but found it to be impossible to set up and configure. There is too much not working stuff and not enough industry support of it (At least for home users) to be viable. All I wanted was my Zonet wireless card to talk to my router running WPA-PSK. I couldn't do it.

Try Ubuntu.


This post would have been so much easier to write if Invision wasn't such epic failure. Get SMF.

There are various other OSes as well.


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blues
post Aug 1 2007, 02:03 PM
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QUOTE(lilcases @ Jul 3 2007, 04:51 PM) *
Thanks,but I'll think about more though.


How new is your computer? What exactly have you been doing to make sure that you might be able to run Vista? (Zelser pretty much laid that out for you though)


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SyphonVectorman
post Aug 30 2007, 02:15 AM
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I was going to get a new computer, but then my parents said to wait for the price to drop more. O:

So uh, it was Vista and they also contacted a friend of their's who was swell with computers.

He said Vista was buggy and we should stay with XP right now.

I mean, I dunno for sure (My parents phoned him) and they told me this after. ):

So um, how much bugs are there anyway and what do they do? D:

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Leyviur
post Aug 30 2007, 08:24 AM
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Vista isn't buggy. Isn't not compaitble with everything that's made for XP, but that's because it's a totally new OS.
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sandpenguin
post Aug 30 2007, 01:26 PM
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Well, if it is buggy, why just update it? I know Microsoft will always give its customers updates to fix up the bugs. New OS always turned up to be like that....Just like when XP first come out long time ago.....


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Raijinili
post Aug 31 2007, 06:29 AM
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Everything is buggy. It's one of the first things they teach us: You WILL have bugs. The preceding statement is blatantly not true.


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Marionette
post Aug 31 2007, 06:39 AM
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...Jesus god, TL;DR posts guys.
Anyway, I've had Vista for a few months now and it's worked perfectly fine. I have no complaints at all.


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zesler
post Jan 4 2008, 05:01 PM
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QUOTE(Leyviur @ Aug 30 2007, 12:24 AM) *

Vista isn't buggy. Isn't not compaitble with everything that's made for XP, but that's because it's a totally new OS.

Can't you still do the right-click, run as .... to attempt to run Vista as XP, 98, etc?


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Raijinili
post Jan 6 2008, 01:30 AM
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I have a huge problem with Vista: It does a wacky "OMG EMERGENCY SHUTDOWN" sometimes when I hibernate it.


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