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Irysa
post Jun 29 2006, 01:30 AM
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Question fest. What is your stance on owning firearms? Should people have a right to defend themselves in this way, or does having a gun in your house simply encourage the shooting of people/schoolkids? Should certain guns be banned, should all of them be banned? Should there be less regulations? What are the pros and cons, etc.

Living in the UK where there are relatively few firearms and gun related incidents ( Knife incidents and whatnot are rife however... ), perhaps I do not fully understand the right to bear arms. Nor do I think the introduction of them here for private ownership will produce anything constructive. Do Americans really feel the need to have a gun for safety, or is it more of a tradition now?

Questions, questions. Let me know your thoughts, please.


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Dr Strum
post Jun 29 2006, 01:51 AM
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First, the "Right to Bear Arms" part of the constitution has nothing to do with owning firearms, it is the right to form militias for protection. It was placed there because at the time a military and police force were never intended to be created. Then when most people saw how crappy their militias were, they left it up to the government to create the army, and later police forces.

Now, rarely do people actually buy firearms for protection. Even if that's their claim, it's one of these things:
  • Hunting
  • Power
  • Comfort
  • Killing
There are some other reasons, for example, armed security guards and sometimes even police have to purchase their own pistols. These are rare of course.
Now, I understand hunting. Partly because my family enjoys hunting. However pistols and automatic rifles will not help you in anyway when hunting, so anyone with weapons like those that claims they're for "hunting purposes" is a fucking liar.
Power: Hold a weapon, of any kind, sword, rifle, whatever, and tell me you don't feel the sudden urge to use it, or a sudden rush of adrenaline. Weapons do make people feel powerful, and a lot of people like it.
For comfort, often people who say they bought it for safety really bought it for comfort. The feeling of being able to destroy your would-be destroyers is morbidly comforting. It does add a bit of confidence to some.
Then the last reason, killing. This shouldn't require any explanation, but guns have no purpose other than killing, whether animals or humans. And some people DO buy them with the intent of killing other people.
The last three reasons are why I'm technically against firearms. Hunting is great and all, but as it stands now, it's winding up the justification for the latter three reasons of firearm ownership.


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Nanashi
post Jun 29 2006, 05:49 AM
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I believe they meant the right for people to own Bear Arms (family guy humor...PLEASE DON'T KILL ME!)

Anyway, I am unsure on my stance on firearms laws. I can see benefits. I can also see the negatives. I can't really comment on this.
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Leyviur
post Jun 29 2006, 06:24 AM
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I want lots of guns so I can reenact the Matrix.

Or at least look cool.
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valkan
post Jun 29 2006, 07:19 AM
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Seeing as how I own a Remington 30.06 for deer hunting, I would have to say I'm for the right to actually own weapons.


But since it's tucked away in a gun locker, I can't exactly use it to defend myself at a moment's notice if someone breaks in my home.




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P.P.A.
post Jun 29 2006, 10:17 AM
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No weapons!
I´m against every form of war, violence or stuff like that. The only people who should be allowed to wear weapons are the police in my opinion.
I hate war, but especially war with firearms. 500 years ago, you saw your enemies in the eyes, you saw who you are killing. Today, soliders hide metres away from each other and don´t even know who they´re fighting with. Killing becomes not the act of ereasing someone´s life but to shoot a target in the background. The value of life goes missing.
Peace and love everywhere!

(I´ve got a lava lamp in my room.)
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Leyviur
post Jun 29 2006, 12:08 PM
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There are so many things wrong with your statements that if this were an exam, you'd get 0%.
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Nanashi
post Jun 29 2006, 12:40 PM
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I'm for firearm ownership. Our government should not be telling us what we can and can't own if it poses no risk in the hands of a normal individual. The best way to handle this is to test people buying firearms for psychological and physical factures as well as their mental ability to own a firearm. That way, people who are genuinely responsible can own their firearms and people who have problems can not. A downside to this solution, is that it won't prevent people who commit premeditated murder, where in most cases the person is in a sane sense of mind. I dunno. My $.02.
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Dr Strum
post Jun 29 2006, 03:23 PM
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QUOTE (Nanashi @ Jun 29 2006, 07:40 AM)
Our government should not be telling us what we can and can't own if it poses no risk in the hands of a normal individual.
Because a gun can't misfire except when held by a crazy, right? Only a crazy's children will ever find the gun and accidently shoot their friend, right?

QUOTE
The best way to handle this is to test people buying firearms for psychological and physical factures as well as their mental ability to own a firearm.
Read above. And what's to stop a normally stable person from getting fired from work and then going on a shooting spree? Or walking in on their significant other with someone else?

QUOTE
That way, people who are genuinely responsible can own their firearms and people who have problems can not.
Again, read above. Another thing, however, the mentally unsound aren't necessarily unresponsible.

QUOTE
A downside to this solution, is that it won't prevent people who commit premeditated murder, where in most cases the person is in a sane sense of mind.
Nor will it stop crimes of passion.


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valkan
post Jun 29 2006, 04:15 PM
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Outlawing or banning the use of private ownership of guns will not prevent people from killing other people. It'll just stop them from doing it efficiently.




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Dr Strum
post Jun 29 2006, 04:32 PM
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I never said it would.
Read Seraph's opening post; guns are rare in the UK, but knifings occur quite often.

Why do you think they're having knife amnesty right now?


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Irysa
post Jun 29 2006, 04:52 PM
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QUOTE (P.P.A. @ Jun 29 2006, 10:17 AM)
No weapons!
I´m against every form of war, violence or stuff like that. The only people who should be allowed to wear weapons are the police in my opinion.
I hate war, but especially war with firearms. 500 years ago, you saw your enemies in the eyes, you saw who you are killing. Today, soliders hide metres away from each other and don´t even know who they´re fighting with. Killing becomes not the act of ereasing someone´s life but to shoot a target in the background. The value of life goes missing.
Peace and love everywhere!

(I´ve got a lava lamp in my room.)

Actually, I think you'd be quite surprised about how many Soldier's suffer from having to know what they've done. The people that can kill without remorse ( or at least remorse that disables their fighting abilities ) at all are always bumped to Snipers.


Very good point Sturm. If you're going to kill someone, you are going to kill someone. If I was going to kill someone, I'd reach for my rifle (had I one) and go and kill them. Presented with the situation where I have no firearm, I'd ambush them in their home with a blade, or simply run them down in the street.

It's also inevitable that a lot of people who own a firearm are mentally or emotionally unfit to. You can't change that. That said, the vast majority of firearm owners are most likely sensible when using or in the presence of their weapon.
It's the same with anything; most drivers are sensible and safe on the road, but there are the smaller percentage who are immature and irresponsible. It's usually those people that cause the problems.

[funny little tune]Hey kids! Guess what time it is?! Time for the Question of the Day! Why does the average law abiding citizen need assault weapons instead of non-assault weapons?[/funny little tune]

I could think of a couple of reasons why people would want an automatic weapon on their property, one of them being the psychological comfort. I don't know about you, but if I had a submachine gun within a few feet of my bed, I'd feel safe at night. Even though I'd obviously would hardly be any safer, as if anyone was burglaring my house, they'd be LESS likely to attack me if I had no means of defending myself...

The other reason is personal choice. Why not have an automatic weapon? Sure, you probably don't need one, but why not want one? As you've said about Hunting Sturm, I personally am not for it, sometimes its necessary though, and I'd actually like to go at least once. Why? Because shooting stuff is fun. There, I said it. It gives people that wonderful little power trip, the power to take life. Whether its right or not.


With intelligence and sensibility it's restrained to culling a couple of pests in the back paddock. Given to an idiot (or someone with poor emotional control) and it could be deadly. Although, give a chilled salad fork to someone with poor emotional control and that could be lethal also.

This post has been edited by Chaos Seraph: Jun 29 2006, 04:56 PM


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Greifer
post Jun 29 2006, 04:54 PM
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I really don't care to much for firearms, but if you feel compelled to carry a gun to protect yourself or whatever, do so at your own risk.


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Irysa
post Jun 29 2006, 04:56 PM
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And the risk of everyone around you.


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[13:27:43] [Sabator] peter would be the worst batman ever though. "turn on the bat-signal" "right!" *turns on huge foglight, beams an image of striped pantsu into the sky*
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Greifer
post Jun 29 2006, 05:27 PM
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True.


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